As 100% of the attempts made to steal goods from Dontronics come from customers using 'free' email addresses (email aliases) we no longer accept any orders from people using a free email service.

Of course, we understand that there are genuine customers who can only access the internet using a free email address, and as we do not wish to preclude these people from purchasing from us, a healthy exchange of email messages helps build confidence in both directions.

If you are a previous customer with a free email address, please remind us of this.  Once we have verified your previous order details, we will quickly process your order.
 

Electronics related sales, see also:
http://www.newfoundelectronics.com/thief%21.htm
http://www.pcworkshop.biz/fraud.htm Indonesian thieves hit again.
We are prepared to link to your Electronics related fraud page, just drop us a line.
 
 

Don't sell to Indonesia
A man in the Netherlands just got stung for $35,000 USD worth of goods from his Web Based Motor Cycle and Scooter accessory shop and sold motor helmets and suits. Students are thieves, don't sell unless you have a faxed copy of their license, credit card, and a signed order. Then insure it so that they have to sign for it. I only sell to verified previous customers. I know of other businesses that have been stung by Indonesia also. Best advice, simply give Indonesia a miss.

25-May-2002 jkmicro.com just got bitten by Indonesia also.
 

Be careful sending goods to Mexico
Some very nice customers, never had one steal from me yet, but postal authorities are thieves, even the courier services get attacked. Best advice, give Mexico a miss also.
 

Never sell to a free email address such as a yahoo or hotmail customer, if they want to use a credit card
Get the customer to make alternative payment arrangement, or fax you the details required to cement the transaction as being genuine. There are many new free email account names springing up daily, and it can be hard to keep up to them. I am suspicious of anything with the word mail in it. You can reverse engineer the addresses and check the sites. If it is in a foreign language and appears to be free, I challenge them. Don't let them steal from you. I am putting together a list of free email host names continually, and refer to this when required.
 

Don't give out tracking numbers to customers unless you know them
25-May-2002 Jim Stewart from jkmicro.com Don't give out tracking numbers to customers unless you know them.  Part of the scam is to have the order shipped to a empty or nonexistent address then when delivery fails, go to the Fedex office and pick up the package with the tracking number.  If the thieves don't have a tracking number they generally cannot pick up the goods and worst-case you have to pay for shipping back.

---

I don't get many users in this game that steal from me, but here are some that have done it with the fraudulent use of Credit Cards. And this is why I don't accept Email aliases for file only orders. If any of these people are prepared to do a funds transfer to me directly, I will drop them from this list. Yes, I have shortened the list already. If the police get to you before you get to me, then bad luck buddy!!!

The alternative is to be constantly hounded by me, and others that support Dontronics. After all, it's the users that pay for this fraud in the final analysis.

I now do an email name search on any address that I am suspicious of. If that fails, I search the newsgroups. It's up to you to convince me that you are real. Yes it all costs time and money!

If a credit card fraud is detected for a file or key order, the details are sent back to the Author of the software. I have no control over what an Author may wish to do with a person who has stolen his software.

Internet ScamBustersTM
Unacceptable Email Domains - Orders Will Be Rejected.

NAUMAN SAEED
MicroTech Lbas
Office#11,2nd Floor Saleem Chambers
114 - McLeod Road
Lahore Punjab  54000
PAKISTAN
----------------------------------
PHONE: +92-42-7122681
FAX:   +92-42-7226328
EMAIL: trl@wol.net.pk

This is the same person that purchased two PIC Books from me in 1998,
and simply told his bank he didn't and left me holding the baby at about
$144AUD This man also frequents mailing lists.

Foot Note 29-Jun-2001
After a long exchange of messages, the above NAUMAN SAEED tells me he isn't the same NAUMAN SAEED that purchased from me in 1998, that NAUMAN SAEED has left the company. He tells me there are 3 NAUMAN SAEED's with the company. I say, all at Office#11,2nd Floor Saleem Chambers? He tells me this is the postal address for the company. I ask to communicate with his boss before I do anything else. Guess what? His name is NAUMAN SAEED, and his email address is the same. He is prepared to send me the company ID's of the 3 NAUMAN SAEED's, but I figure these must be easy to conjure up if this is the case, but he can't send me details of the NAUMAN SAEED that stole from me. I decide to refund his money and not get stung again. Not worth the chance. What do you think?

 product        BASCOM-8051 BASIC Compiler. ~$69USD
 card_type      VISA
 account
 exp_m          03
 exp_y          02
 card_name      ANDY LONDON
 your_name      ANDY LONDON
 company_name
 address1       6 OLD LYME RD
 address2
 city           Lutherville
 state          MD
 zip            21093
 country        USA
 daytime        4105614800
 fax
 email          ad@pmail.net

Straight forward this one, stolen card number, bodgy email address. What did I learn?
Never trust an email address that has the word 'mail' in it.

As I sent two of these packages insured, I know there must be records at the post office in Cairo regarding this. I have also faxed VISA in Cairo to assist me in chasing this man down, and escalated the matter within the banking system.
Anyone in Cairo, if you wouldn't mind checking the address for me, and passing this information on to the police thanks.
Only too happy to supply all information, and compensate for any out of pocket expenses.

His e-mail address is very active, and he will return you a message I'm sure. Perhaps even swear at you like he does to me.
He rambles on about me being paid, then tells me he will send the money Western Union, and requests details. This is all just a lead on, as he is simply flaunting his ability to steal and get away with it. He has changed his name now to John Darling. You can send him a message at arbsec@hotmail.com

20-Aug-2000 Case 8

card_type                  VISA
account
exp_m                      02
exp_y                      01
card_name                  Hadi mosa
your_name                  Mohamed El said abdel hadi
company_name
address1                   269 portsaid st
address2                   downtown
city                       cairo
state                      cairo
zip                        00202
country                    egypt
daytime                    002024873488
fax
email               arbsec@hotmail.com
send it to Mohamed El said abdel hadi Purchase
Enter_the_items_to_order   Warp-13 Assembled and Tested PIC Programmer
                           ~$109USD

Package was sent insured, card owner challenged transaction.
Appears card was stolen.

2-Aug-2000 Case 7

Subject:              Re: credit card problem.
        Date:           Thu, 24 Feb 2000 10:12:10 +1100
         To:    admin@nikitajm.net, admin@bggrafiti.org, Pavica Brkic <pavica_b@bggrafiti.org>,
           versus99@popmail.com

You keep saying what is the problem?
You told your bank that you didn't order 3 individual orders I have from
you, and you did this within about 2 weeks of ordering. in the case of
the physical goods, you didn't even wait to get them air mail before
challenging my bank.

I am now putting all of the orders and your return email to my bank to
sort you out, as they only give me 14 days, and I have been asking since
the 17th of feb, and you haven't given me any sort of an explanation as
to what you are doing to me and why you are doing it.

Cheers Don...
 

Don McKenzie wrote:
>
> admin wrote:
> >
> > What is the problem my friend ?
> > Aaahhhh, I am realy sorry, but I wasn't able to check my Email, is my order sent ? Hmm ..
you have problems with credit card ? No, problem, anyway I do not know what is the metter but
anyway I will ask my friend to send you his credit card and also I would like to change
shipping adress, the guy who will send you a credit card, he is working in the company near me,
and he is administrator of the server there, his Email is admin@bggrafiti.org
> > , I will tell him to sent you that as fast as it is possible, I am realy sorry because you
waited. And also if the order is not sent I would like to change shipping adress. Is that ok ?
> > Best regards, and sorry again.
>
> It appears you have contacted the bank and told them you didn't spend
> the money that is the problem, they want me to prove otherwise. I have
> two different messages from the bank regarding the same credit card, if
> this order is genuine and non-fraudulent, then I suggest you contact
> your bank asap, and stop challenging this transaction, or find out why
> it is being challenged. 

Subject:              Re: Dontronics Order and Email Confirmation.
       Date            Thu, 16 Dec 1999 11:26:19 +0100
      From      "GSM Trader" <grgolj@ptt.yu>
        To:             "Don McKenzie" <dontronics.com>

Ok,
I'll wait for Programmers.
And i'll read all notes.

thanks.
     ----- Original Message -----
     From: Don McKenzie
     To: GSM Trader
     Sent: Thursday, December 16, 1999 11:03 AM
     Subject: Re: Dontronics Order and Email Confirmation.

     Thanks for the order, will ship asap, this means I have your money, and
     HK has your order.
     Please read http://www.dontronics.com/diyk96.html for potential delivery
     delays on
     kits from Hong Kong.

     the atmel programmer will come from me here in Australia, it is on it's
     way also. thanks for the order.

     Cheers Don...

     > GSM Trader wrote:
     > Just Confirming my orders (PIC Programmer Kits).
      > thanks.
      > b.r.
     > GSM Trade Co. Ltd.
------------------------------
This man orders the goods, exchanges messages with me, and doesn't claim from his post office the Programmer I sent from Australia, so it is returned to me. He keeps the kits sent from HK, and tells his bank he never ordered them.

Now he doesn't answer my email, he did when he wanted the programmers.

In this case, the programmer I sent was an AVR ISP X-Programmer, and I had another customer that day in Brasil that wanted one also. As I had decided to drop this range of programmers, I had to tell the man in Brasil that I couldn't help him, and got him to contact the manufacturer. As it turns out, I am now stuck with this programmer. It can be seen on my specials.html page.

Tell this man what you think of him by sending a message to: "GSM Trader" <grgolj@ptt.yu>

Subject:      Nondeliverable mail
   Date:       1 Aug 2000 16:31:14 -0700
   From:       Postmaster <Postmaster@msn.com>

------Transcript of session follows -------
picisko@msn.com
The user's email name is not found.

So, his email was finally removed.

This is a straight forward one that it looks like he has used some one elses Credit card, and his own msn.com account. So I have supressed the original name and address, but please send him an email if you wish.

Form data received on 01/25/99 09:53:39 PM.
This order came from someone on Internet host 195.98.129.109
(ip address195.98.129.109).

  product        CyberCircuit Plus ~$39USD
 card_type      VISA
 card_name
 your_name
 company_name
 address1
 address2
 city           Milwaukee
 state          WI
 zip            53204
 country        USA
 daytime
 fax
 email         picisko@msn.com 

29-Oct-98
   ----- The following address had permanent fatal errors -----
<carastas@usa.net>
   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
... while talking to mxpool01.netaddress.usa.net.:
>>> RCPT To:<carastas@usa.net>
<<< 552 <carastas@usa.net>... User exceed storage quota
554 <carastas@usa.net>... Service unavailable

Does this means I finally got to him???

It was on hold and registered to Bill Adams slavadark@usa.net
2345 Castillejo Way
Freemont, CA 94539-5105
US
(465) 762-2636
I sent Bill email, but never got a reply. Was this an elaborate scheme just to steal $45 from me???

29-Oct-98
   ----- The following address had permanent fatal errors -----
<slava@darksystem.com>
   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
... while talking to mxpool01.netaddress.usa.net.:

550 <slava@darksystem.com>... Host unknown (Name server: darksystem.com: host not found)

So he unregistered his site????

Hi,
I am working on motor speed controls and need to develop PID
algorithm in 80c51 assembly language. Can anybody help? I'll be much
obliged.
Thanks Nauman
mtl@ms.net.pk

This man purchased two "Square 1" PIC books from Dontronics to the value of  $144AUD.
He used his own credit card, confirmed with me that he got the two books, then told his bank that he hadn't ordered them. I have exchanged several messages with him in the past regarding the order, but he is now silent. I found this recent message from him with a search engine. I am amazed that this man is so blatant. I can see many of my friends messages on this forum.
This card holder is from Pakistan.

And guess what? A response straight away!!! 5-Oct-98
Subject:       Re: http://www.dontronics.com/fraud.html
       Date:    Mon, 05 Oct 1998 16:25:54 +0500
      From:    Nauman Saeed <mtl@ms.net.pk>
        To:      Don McKenzie <dontronics.com>

Don McKenzie wrote:
> http://www.dontronics.com/fraud.html
> will be set up shortly so that all credit cards thief's that have stolen
> from Dontronics can be pinpointed and targeted by many users, not just
> me.
> The only way out of this is a bank transfer of funds now.

Mr.Don I 've checked with my bank. They tell me that due to international
economical sentions no us $ can be transferred in any other country. As this
transaction was taking place while the sanctions were being carried out they
have deducted the money from my account.  I don't know how long it will take
UNO to lift sentions from my country. So one thing that i can do is send the
books back to you. Send me your mail address and I'll ship you the books.
 Thanks.
--------------------------------------------------
5-Oct-98
Nauman,
Normally I wouldn't quote a personal email message in an open forum, but in your case I am prepared to make an exception.
You stole from me, you blocked the credit card payment at your bank months ago, then you lied to me several times.
You have admitted you purchased and received the books.
The funds were charged in Australian Dollars on an Australian bank to an Australian citizen, what has that got to do with U.S. sanctions?
Regarding the return of the books. Do I have idiot tattooed on my forehead?
Make arrangements for funds transfer now!!!

Don...

LHR    BRANCH   CSA  ID  841  08May98  12:17  TRANS#  984608998   0-

        Check with your bank and stop sending me stupid emails.
============================================
6-Oct-98
Yes that's the one you put a stop on back in May. I haven't got the money and you are changing the story again. First you say you can't pay because of US trade sanctions, (yesterday) and today you say you paid me in May.

I have all the documentation that tells me you not only stole from me, but also from the banks, both our banks in fact. You stole time which is money to them. Yes you cheated on your bank also.

Don...
 

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